Regulating Kids!
Around here we’re having one of those days, there’s more yelling, crying and carrying on than there needs to be, and the kids aren’t exactly playing ‘nice’ either. But we get through those days, take deep breaths, remind ourselves that we’re filled with love and eventually it begins to flow forth again. Usually, at least around here, no one needs to ‘change’ their behaviour- or ourselves, we of course are behaving the best we can given the circumstances (and our particular circumstances is exhaustion from a dinner/dance, and the ren faire this weekend.) We just need to change our mood. Regain our optimism. Have you ever noticed that the mouthy-lip from your 3 year old can be totally endearing at times and infuriating at others? We all would gain if we spent less time trying to change our kids and more time working on ourselves, our own reactions. And then serve as that role model of love and respect and generosity and good spirits, so that our children return it in kind. That’s it in a nutshell, my parenting philosophy. Notice that it doesn’t have anything about perfection, and allows for bad temper (in me and the kids, even darling superhero too.)
Well, just the other day I witnessed a mother shoving her screaming 6 year old into a swing calling her a big baby over and over, I have no idea what her perceived infraction was…I really don’t want to know. I saw a mother completely out of control, okay maybe there’s a bit of us all in there, right? But then the inexplicable happened, the other grown woman in the group took her camera out of her bag and started to snap pictures and say out loud “I’m taking pictures of the big baby, acting like a big baby!” So there you have it, not a mother out of control, but planned; cold, calculating and horrifying. I was too shocked to do anything about it, and really what could I have done? it’s one thing to step in and help a mother at the end of her rope, another to interfere with an insane parenting tactic learned off the today show…
read it and weep.
Love,
Heather
this musing is related to this comic:Strange Goals!
enjoybirth said,
May 6, 2008 @ 11:52 am
Wow, that was a scary parenting article.
I will say I love my timer and it is handy for 5 minute room resuces, where we all, as a team, clean up a room for 5 minutes. It is also great for other things too. Like saying we will get ready for bed when the timer rings. It helps them know time is up. BUT there are no punishments attatched to it, it is all good and positive.
I didn’t see one thing in her article that was about lifting kids up. It was about tearing them down. Which is very sad indeed.
mrs.mama21 said,
May 6, 2008 @ 2:02 pm
Hathor-
Thought you might be interested in the questions raised by this article: http://news.aol.com/health/story/ar/_a/breast-fed-children-smarter-study-finds/20080506091309990001?icid=1615988631×1201622612x1200302629#cmntbgn
We all know that breastfed children tend to score higher on IQ tests, but what exactly is it that makes them smarter? Is it the actual content of the milk? Is it all the lovely physical contact and interaction? Is it simply that breastfeeding mothers are DIFFERENT and more invested in their children (spend more time with them, raise them healthier, etc.)? Is it all these things working perfectly together?
wiffersnapper said,
May 6, 2008 @ 2:30 pm
I prefer to use techniques that don’t make the kid hate me or herself, personally! I will admit that the timer thing does work- I use it with my spec. ed. kids. Counting backwards also works- it gives them a more definite definition of when something needs to be done. Again, however, the only negative consequence they get if they’re not there when I’m done counting is a hairy eyeball. And they’re usually having fun trying to get everything done, so it’s not a problem! I can’t imagine running my kids’ favorite DVD through a shredder as a consequence- that’s cruel and unusual punishment!
julie said,
May 6, 2008 @ 5:16 pm
I see Flylady language!
That whole approach in the article is modeling a specific behavior: manipulation through reward and punishment. When parents act that way they get it right back. That parenting raises manipulative children in my opinion. BE the person you want your child to be. I want my child to have a backbone and so I model that, but I don’t want my child to be a bully. How terrible to suggest holding their relationship with grandma against them!! And shredding CD’s? This lady must be rich or something. Stupid stupid stupid.
thepooka said,
May 6, 2008 @ 7:51 pm
Mild heart palpitations upon reading this article. The base assumption is that a child has control over every action, can consistently live up to parental standards, and just needs sufficient motivation to do so.
What reality are these people living in? Certainly not one that allows for, oh, undiagnosed learning disabilities.
Like the one I grew up with.
No, no, no! The truth is I didn’t need to be “motivated”…I wanted to do whatever was fair and reasonable to keep the good favor of my parents. I needed *help* with my behavioral problems. My parents tried the whole punishment-reward system on me, and it just didn’t work. All they got was a kid who had very few privileges and still wasn’t getting her schoolwork done…the rewards meant nothing to me except yet another unattainable goal, and the punishments became just part of my life, something I would inevitably have to live with. Thank goodness I got certain things “just for existing” or I would have been a sad child, indeed. Also, thank goodness they also looked for ways to help me, when the system failed.
msrlmoss said,
May 7, 2008 @ 2:36 am
Well, I tried to leave a comment but it bounced back: I suggested she go and read some positive parenting books e.g. Natural Child, Unconditional Parenting, and then take a look at the video tape she made of herself writing that article and feel very, very ashamed.
blessedbaby said,
May 7, 2008 @ 2:57 am
I couldn’t even read the entire article. It stuns me that she has “experience”. Exactly what is that experience? I spent years working with young children and families, and found that her techniques are the easy way out. They produce quick results in the short term, by constantly enforcing rewards and punishment. External control What about self-control? What about intrinsic rewards? The techniques that teach our children how to manage their own behavior by recognizing their moods, knowing themselves, and developing empathy, takes a longer time, more patience and energy, and gives us the long term results we’re looking for. Happy, healthy, well-adjusted adults who can control themselves and take care of others. Super-nanny style parenting is lazy parenting in my opinion. If I don’t have to think about what my child is really telling me, if I can just plop her into time out and get her to stop crying, or give her a sticker when she does something good, then I win, right? But we all lose. Getting down on my DD’s level and really listening when her 2 year old screaming has kicked in can usually give me the clue that she’s tired, or hungry, or overstimulated and needs me to help her regulate herself. Raising happy children takes real time, and in our immediate gratification society so many parents assume it doesn’t work because their kiddos aren’t sitting quietly that same day. It’s a sad sad day when “experts” tell us we need to give our kids toys to be good, and make them sit on a carpet to “think” about being bad instead of spending the time to give them what they really need.
wiffersnapper said,
May 7, 2008 @ 3:48 am
What amazes me about those shows is that people are willing to let the whole world see how badly they’ve screwed up their kids! I can’t watch them- I feel so embarassed for those poor children. When you’ve never been taught how to behave correctly, your poor behavior is not your fault. In other words, as teachers know- Meeting the parents usually answers the question- Why is this kid like this?
Julinda said,
May 7, 2008 @ 5:20 am
Sorry, I was afraid to read the article. The “big baby” story bothered me enough so I can imagine what the article is like. I just feel so sad for these kids. I admit there are times when I get frustrated and I say mean things to my kids, but I apologize and try to do better next time. (They understand - they mess up sometimes too.) I don’t intentionally try to shame them or hurt their feelings or upset them just to get them behave. My younger son has been going through a stubborn - er - determined phase lately and as I told my husband, I’m glad the kids are so determined. They know what they want and they don’t give up until they get it. I don’t want to squelch that in them. I don’t know what I want, and when I do, I’m too afraid to go after it. (With my older son it’s not a phase, it’s definitely who he is!) I want them to have the self-esteem and confidence that have been missing from my life.
jmcqbigler said,
May 7, 2008 @ 7:40 am
wow what bad advice its loke supoernanny it supposed to work for everyone and everything. Because all kids are the same and what works for one works for all:( How dumb beside the ideas are just awful the shame technique with the video and grandparents is just uggg. Shredding cd’s and dvd’s you will just have to buy them again and it says that it’s not big deal to destroy posessions. I have a hard enough time teaching my kids that things cost money without me just destroying them to prove a point. I could never imagine shamming my kid by making them do something they do not want to and making fun of them in front of other parents that is even more humilating. That child will probably never want to go on a swing again.
mamaof5 said,
May 7, 2008 @ 10:03 am
i couldn’t read the whole article.. too disturbing. It is shocking to me that her advice is considered “good” and taking time to figure out what is going on with your kid is not.
i am shocked by how so many parents don’t want to put in the time it takes to be a good person to their kids. it reminds me of a Hathor comic from a few years ago.. where the family is standing there saying how it takes a long time in the kitchen to get the beans just right… and that is true. Being a parent is a long road and you have to enjoy the journey and not be so focused on what happens at the end.. because if you are enjoying the trip, you actaully will have great happy adults at the end (the kids… and YOU).
dh’s niece had a poster in her kids play room that was a little girl standing in the corner with her head down with the word “SHAME” in big letters at the bottom along with a bible verse (it was a very “pretty” picture, very fancy looking). She said it was a reminder to her kids. Wacky!
Heather in Tucson
rainbowrecognizer said,
May 7, 2008 @ 2:07 pm
Hey, Ladies :o)
I love ~absolutely love~ Hathor’s comics and have now featured them in two articles at HubPages.com! I so appreciate the inspiration and passing along of information so I can really focus on what I want in this world! (I’m always looking at the stuff that disgusts me in this manner these days…)
http://hubpages.com/hub/Do-You-Really-Want-To-Control-Your-Children
http://hubpages.com/hub/How-to-have-the-Birth-of-your-Dreams
Enjoy ~
Amy
sapphire_chan said,
May 8, 2008 @ 8:27 am
I refuse to read the scary article, but I’m saving your response from the comic in case someone tries to tell me to use the techniques from the article. “Sorry, I have no interest in using a technique from the Dark Ages to teach my kids to give into bullies.”
Melissa said,
May 8, 2008 @ 11:01 am
Both the comment and the big baby story made me absolutely sick. I had to go hug and play with my daughter to feel better.
I tried to leave a comment on the article but it got bounced back. Maybe they are only bouncing back the comments that suggest their methods are archaic, sick, twisted, and cruel.
Had I been at the playground with Hathor I would have been tempted to shout out for everyone to hear “Hey! Why are you bullying that poor child? You big meanie!” Certainly not the best way to handle the situation, but maybe a public shaming of the “adult” would have been called for to make her realize what she was doing.
Shame on them!
soulgasm said,
May 8, 2008 @ 11:22 am
negative reinforcement ftw!
and people onder why kids are sending tapes of themselves beating the shit out of classmates to youtube, or attacking old ladies for drivig too slow.
Persephone said,
May 8, 2008 @ 11:29 am
I think if tantrums in an older child are an issue, then taping it and showing them what they look like can be an eye opener- it also works on adults who have temper tantrums.
Calling a melting down child a big baby, and threatening to take pictures in public is sickening, and abusive, IMO.
I didn’t read much of the article because it seemed to be rather behaviorialist, and using rewards and punishments in parenting isn’t really my cup of tea.
julie said,
May 8, 2008 @ 11:47 am
OK, I just watched the attached video. It doesn’t play well on my computer; the sounds is early and choppy and the video is jerky. But as they get to the shredder and she demonstrates how she shreds the DVD both she and the interviewer get these amused smiles. It’s just weird. I get the vibe that they are thinking about how fun it would be to shred their kids stuff. By the end they are grinning ear to ear. It’s quite eerie. OK, even if you felt that taking away a toy forever would be appropriate (because hey to each their own) wouldn’t it be better to donate it?
It’s one thing to read this crap, but then to see her telling someone else and he’s like, yeah, shame the little one, cool! When I’m thinking that any sane person would be like, you’re freaking me out you crazy mean lady! I just.. Oh my…
wiffersnapper said,
May 9, 2008 @ 1:58 am
What’s really sad is that kids who’re raised like will grow up thinking that it’s okay to treat children that way… and then go on to treat their own children the same way. One of the things they taught at my college in our “how to discipline your class” class was that you NEVER discipline a child in public if you can possibly avoid it. Granted, if I ask a student to go out into the hallway with me, everyone knows they’re in trouble. However, they already knew that from watching someone behave inappropriately, (because they all know what the rules are!), and the actual discussion between me and the student in question is private. If you shame a kid in front of their peers, the biggest thought in their mind isn’t “How can I avoid getting into trouble this way again?”, but “How can I get back at this person for embarassing me like this?”
This article really disturbed me. A lot.
sheepdoc said,
May 9, 2008 @ 7:08 pm
So a little afield from this topic but yesterday I took my 4 year old out for ice cream and then we went to Starbucks to get a coffee to share. While I was reading the menu he punched me. He wasn’t mad, he just out of the blue punched me for no reason. Well no reason I could discern at the time. I simply said, “Time to go. No coffee.” and walked out of the shop. He was sad and tried to talk me out of it but he walked out w/ me. I didn’t even have to hold his hand. We walked around the strip mall a bit more looked at one more store at his request and then got in the car to get home.
Within 5 minutes of being in the car he was asleep. He slept for 12 hours. Now I know why he hit me. He wasn’t being willful or mean. He simply was overwhelmed by feelings/needs he couldn’t identify and they needed to be released somehow.
I’m betting if I had punished him for hitting me he would have gotten more wound up and NOT fallen asleep and his needs would have been unmet and we would have been in a vicious cycle. I am so proud of him for accepting leaving so nicely, too. Its not easy for him - and it just shows that my parenting methods and thoughts on public behavior are paying off. I mean really how many 4 year olds that hit a parent just quietly and dociley follow them out of a store without causing a scene?
Kat_MomofMonkeys said,
May 11, 2008 @ 3:31 pm
We’ve all had our moments of being desperate and trying something “out there” in terms of dealing with our kids’ worse days, but omg… anything that involves belittling a child, publicly embarassing them (where it’s not that you’re just embarassing them by putting them in a time out or by making them leave early, you’re just using embarassment alone as the method of discipline), that’s just SICK.
My own mother was emotionally abusive and even this kind of stuff is beyond her realm. I can’t believe that there is someone with a degree (wonder what her degree is in) suggesting this!
Naturally, kids can lose priveleges, toys, etc, for lengths of time as a natural consequence, and timeouts are good for letting a kid calm down so you can talk to them or even just letting the parent take a few minutes to calm down before talking about it so they are more rational.